Archive for September, 2011

Old Research, New Resources, Fresh Eyes

September 18th, 2011

I started researching my family history in August 1977, just over 34 years ago and I am amazed at the changes over that time. Anyone starting out now can’t appreciate just how hard it was back then, especially trying to do it from Australia. Yesterday I proved (I think) that I made a fundamental error back then but without access to today’s resources, the decisions I made then were all reasonable and based on available evidence. I welcome feedback on the saga that unfolds below.

In 1977 I started buying all my Australian certificates not just key ones but all the children’s certificates too. I wanted all the details so that I could trace my families over time.

Thomas and Elizabeth Price arrived in Sydney in 1878 a few months after their marriage in Staffordshire. They had ten children across New South Wales and Queensland. From each of the children’s birth certificates I gathered information on Thomas and Elizabeth.

Elizabeth’s maiden name was Judge and she was born ca 1857 in Croughton, Oxfordshire, Northamptonshire and even Staffordshire – all places she gave on the birth certificates. Her death certificate gave her parents as George Judge and Elizabeth Ann Silk (I was sceptical of the Silk name as that was connected to the Price family).

From the family bible she had brought out with her I knew the date that she and Thomas had married so I applied for the marriage certificate. This also gave her father’s name as George Judge. So armed with all this information in 1979 I applied for her birth certificate. These were the days before indexes were widely available or online so I had the Registrar do a search. There was only one Elizabeth Judge born in 1857 in Brackley, Northamptonshire – quite close to Croughton. The certificate showed that Elizabeth was the illegitimate daughter of Harriet Judge. No other Elizabeth matched the details that I had and I assumed (that magic word) that she had not wanted Thomas to know that she was illegitimate and had said George was her father to cover up.

I then engaged a profession researcher in Northamptonshire to find Harriet Judge’s family and she was the daughter of Thomas and Hannah Judge and had various siblings. The researcher also found the family in the various census returns – all before indexes and digitised images. The only thing he didn’t find was Elizabeth Judge, Harriet’s child – where was she?

The years went past, and every so often I would revisit my Judge family. I even hired the microfilm at the local Family History Centre and checked the census returns myself but that was like looking for a needle in a haystack. Then the English BDMs became available on microfiche and I decided to trace Harriet – she must have married and perhaps Elizabeth was with her in that new family.

I found Harriet who had married a George Gardiner in 1860. I searched the 1861 census (and subsequent censuses) for them but still no Elizabeth. What had Harriet done with her illegitimate child Elizabeth?

Again the years past and then we had access to digitised images of the census and online indexes. Surely I would find Elizabeth now. But no, I still couldn’t locate any reference to her other than that birth certificate and her marriage certificate. Where was she for 21 years?

Elizabeth had spent her last years living with her daughter in law, Alice Price and my mother. Mum used to tell me how Elizabeth would always have lollies waiting for her when she got home from school. My mother wanted to know what Elizabeth’s  life was like in England and how had she met Thomas Price. That was an interesting question – if she was in Northamptonshire, how had she met Thomas Price in West Bromwich, Staffordshire?

A few months ago I made a determined search to find Elizabeth in the 1861 census – she was about four years old but I couldn’t find any Elizabeth Judge that might be her. After another recent visit to Mum I again came home determined to find her in the 1871 census. If she married Thomas Price in 1878 she had to be somewhere in 1871.

Again I looked at every possible Elizabeth Judge, only this time I did turn up a family in the 1871 census – father George (as on her marriage certificate), mother Ann (not that far from Elizabeth Ann on her death certificate) and an Elizabeth, 13 years old, born in Northamptonshire. They were also living in West Bromwich where Thomas Price was. What made it even more exciting was that George was born in Croughton, the place Elizabeth said she was born and there was a sister Eliza. Surely a family wouldn’t have both an Eliza and an Elizabeth?

My first thoughts were that George was some relative of Harriet’s or her parents John and Hannah Judge and that George and his wife had looked after the illegitimate Elizabeth. But looking at my Judge family I couldn’t see how George could fit in. Then it occurred to me why hadn’t I found this George Judge, Ann, Elizabeth and other siblings in the 1861 census?

So back to the 1861 census and no they were not there. I hadn’t missed them and I was checking both Ancestry and FindMyPast sites so I just couldn’t understand any of it. Another daughter was called Eunice and that had to be more uncommon than George, Elizabeth or Ann. I then searched the 1861 census for all females named Eunice born ca 1853 and it was a nice short list.

There was Eunice born in Croughton, Northamptonshire with her sister Elizabeth also born in Croughton together with mother Ann and other siblings. The only difference was that the surname was Pollard not Judge. Ann was a 35 year old widow with five children. Between the 1861 and 1871 census she had married George Judge and taken his surname as did all of her children. They had also moved from Croughton to West Bromwich.

By the 1881 census George and Ann Judge and family were living in Potters Lane, West Bromwich – the same street as Thomas Price and his family. This must have been how and where Elizabeth and Thomas met.

Had I at long last found my Elizabeth Judge who was really Elizabeth Pollard? The reason I could never find another possible birth certificate for my Elizabeth Judge was that she was born with the surname Pollard but took her stepfather George Judge’s name when her mother remarried.

What happened to Harriet Judge’s illegitimate child Elizabeth? I have not checked for deaths and perhaps she was adopted or fostered out and ended up with another surname too.

I have other step marriages in my family history but this is the only time when the children have taken the surname of the stepfather. I can see that this could result in many brickwalls and if there hadn’t been an Elizabeth born about the right time and place I might have hit a brickwall, instead I hit a red herring.

The digitisation and indexing of census records (and everything else) allows us now to find family complexities like this easier and quicker. In hindsight with new resources it all looks so easy, and it is. If there is any aspect in your own research that niggles, perhaps its time to take a fresh look!


52 Weeks of Personal Genealogy & History Week 37 Earliest Memories

September 17th, 2011

I’m participating in the weekly blogging theme 52 Weeks of Personal Genealogy & History and this week’s topic is all about our earliest memories. I find it hard to define earliest – is it what I actually remember or what I think I remember? A lot of  early photographs of me with my family often make me think I remember but I suspect I am just remembering having seen the photos before, and not the actual event.

Most of the earliest memories that spring to my mind are from Grade One at school – this was a big change in my life and I clearly remember the first day because I was so scared. That morning I proudly got dressed in my new uniform and Mum packed my lunch and a cold drink bottle into my school port which I carried on my back. I had been looking forward to going to school so much. Although Bardon State School in Brisbane was only about a 10-15 minute walk from our place, by the time I walked there on my own, I had scared myself silly. My mother had stayed at home with my younger brother.

Shauna in her Bardon State School uniform

Shauna in her Bardon State School uniform

It was 50 years ago and kids did walk to school then so what spooked me? Unknown to me my drink bottle was leaking and seeping out onto the back of my uniform. I had been told not to stop anywhere, so I kept going but was increasingly frightened by the ever spreading sticky wetness on my back. Had I been a little older I might have twigged it was just a leaky bottle but at the time it was all too strange.

Fortunately my first ever teacher was a lovely, motherly kind of woman and she immediately saw what the problem was and that I was upset. She was the type of teacher that kept spare children’s clothes at school just in case of illness or accidents. She helped me take off the uniform and put on a change of clothes and then rinsed it out so that it didn’t stain.

I can’t remember much more about that day but I have lots of memories from that first year of school and the things we did together in class. She was an excellent first year teacher and made our transition into the education system easier.

My memories of school after that year are not so pleasant and was often dependent on how well I got on with the teacher. But then that’s a story for another blog!


The Tech Savvy Genealogists’ Meme

September 15th, 2011

Another Geniaus challenge – interestingly it captures all of the issues I have been looking at over the last few months ie new phone, tablet, netbook, scanner etc – parts of me want to be tech savvy but other parts of me want to go back to my Grade one slate and pencil!! Read on to see my answers.

The list should be annotated in the following manner:

Things you have already done or found: bold face type
Things you would like to do or find: italicize (colour optional)
Things you haven’t done or found and don’t care to: plain type

Feel free to add extra comments in brackets after each item

Which of these apply to you?

1 Own an Android or Windows tablet or an iPad (still trying to make a decision)
2 Use a tablet or iPad for genealogy related purposes (see 1)
3 Have used Skype to for genealogy purposes
4 Have used a camera to capture images in a library/archives/ancestor’s home
5 Use a genealogy software program on your computer to manage your family tree
6 Have a Twitter account
7 Tweet daily (just passed 11,000 tweets so I must love it)
8 Have a genealogy blog
9 Have more then one genealogy blog
10 Have lectured/presented to a genealogy group on a technology topic
11 Currently an active member of Genealogy Wise (should visit more often)
12 Have a Facebook Account
13 Have connected with genealogists via Facebook (amazed at number of distant relatives who have contacted me this way)
14 Maintain a genealogy related Facebook Page (not a real Facebook fan)
15 Maintain a blog or website for a genealogy society
16 Have submitted text corrections online to Ancestry, Trove or a similar site
17 Have registered a domain name
18 Post regularly to Google+
19 Have a blog listed on Geneabloggers
20 Have transcribed/indexed records for FamilySearch or a similar project
21 Own a Flip-Pal or hand-held scanner (another must make a decision/do)
22 Can code a webpage in .html
23 Own a smartphone (another must make a decision/do)
24 Have a personal subscription to one or more paid genealogy databases (couldn’t live without instant access)
25 Use a digital voice recorder to record genealogy lectures (with speaker’s permission of course)
26 Have contributed to a genealogy blog carnival
27 Use Chrome as a Browser (except Scotland’s People & some other sites don’t like it, use Firefox then)
28 Have participated in a genealogy webinar (listened)
29 Have taken a DNA test for genealogy purposes
30 Have a personal genealogy website (have a combined business/personal website and should put more family info up)
31 Have found mention of an ancestor in an online newspaper archive
32 Have tweeted during a genealogy lecture
33 Have scanned your hardcopy genealogy files (not all of them yet, work in progress)
34 Use an RSS Reader to follow genealogy news and blogs
35 Have uploaded a gedcom file to a site like Geni, MyHeritage or Ancestry
36 Own a netbook (in anticipation, picking it up this weekend, first of many new toys)
37 Use a computer/tablet/smartphone to take genealogy lecture notes (still a pen/paper girl but I’m trying to change)
38 Have a profile on LinkedIn that mentions your genealogy habit
39 Have developed a genealogy software program, app or widget
40 Have listened to a genealogy podcast online
41 Have downloaded genealogy podcasts for later listening
42 Backup your files to a portable hard drive
43 Have a copy of your genealogy files stored offsite (I used to when I worked, have given copies to relatives)
44 Know about Rootstech
45 Have listened to a Blogtalk radio session about genealogy
46 Use Dropbox, SugarSync or other service to save documents in the cloud
47 Schedule regular email backups
48 Have contriibuted to the Familysearch Wiki
49 Have scanned and tagged your genealogy photographs (another work in progress)
50 Have published a genealogy book in an online/digital format (drafts done, just need to say that’s it!)


My 99 Things Genealogy Meme – Australian Style

September 7th, 2011

My 99 Things Genealogy Meme – Australian

This genealogy challenge was issued by Geniaus and the list should be annotated as follows:

Things you have already done or found – bold type
Things you would like to do or find – italics (colour optional)
Things you have not done or found and don’t care to – plain type

  1. Belong to a genealogical society
  2. Joined the Australian Genealogists group on Genealogy Wise
  3. Transcribed records
  4. Uploaded headstone pictures to Find-A-Grave or a similar site
  5. Documented ancestors for four generations (self, parents, grandparents, great-grandparents)
  6. Joined Facebook
  7. Cleaned up a run-down cemetery
  8. Joined the Genea-Bloggers Group
  9. Attended a genealogy conference
  10. Lectured at a genealogy conference
  11. Spoke on a genealogy topic at a local genealogy society
  12. Joined the Society of Australian Genealogists (member once, now  member of other State societies)
  13. Contributed to a genealogy society publication
  14. Served on the board or as an officer of a genealogy society
  15. Got lost on the way to a cemetery
  16. Talked to dead ancestors
  17. Researched outside the state in which I live
  18. Knocked on the door of an ancestral home and visited with the current  occupants
  19. Cold called a distant relative
  20. Posted messages on a surname message board
  21. Uploaded a gedcom file to the internet
  22. Googled my name
  23. Performed a random act of genealogical kindness
  24. Researched a non-related family, just for the fun of it
  25. Have been paid to do genealogical research
  26. Earn a living (majority of income) from genealogical research
  27. Wrote a letter (or email) to a previously unknown relative
  28. Contributed to one of the genealogy carnivals
  29. Responded to messages on a message board
  30. Was injured while on a genealogy excursion
  31. Participated in a genealogy meme
  32. Created family history gift items (calendars, cookbooks, etc.)
  33. Performed a record lookup
  34. Took a genealogy seminar cruise
  35. Am convinced that a relative must have arrived here from outer space (or swam here)
  36. Found a disturbing family secret
  37. Told others about a disturbing family secret (our ancestors were human  & we need to understand context)
  38. Combined genealogy with crafts (family picture quilt, scrapbooking)
  39. Think genealogy is a passion not a hobby
  40. Assisted finding next of kin for a deceased person
  41. Taught someone else how to find their roots
  42. Lost valuable genealogy data due to a computer crash or hard drive failure
  43. Been overwhelmed by available genealogy technology (love it)
  44. Know a cousin of the 4th degree or higher
  45. Disproved a family myth through research
  46. Got a family member to let you copy photos
  47. Used a digital camera to “copy” photos or records
  48. Translated a record from a foreign language
  49. Found an immigrant ancestor’s passenger arrival record
  50. Looked at census records on microfilm, not on the computer
  51. Used microfiche
  52. Visited the Family History Library in Salt Lake City
  53. Used Google+ for genealogy
  54. Visited a church or place of worship of one of your ancestors
  55. Taught a class in genealogy
  56. Traced ancestors back to the 18th Century
  57. Traced ancestors back to the 17th Century
  58. Traced ancestors back to the 16th Century
  59. Can name all of your great-great-grandparents (except for 2 illegitimate  births, therefore don’t know fathers)
  60. Found an ancestor on the Australian Electoral Rolls
  61. Know how to determine a soundex code without the help of a computer
  62. Have found relevant articles on Trove
  63. Own a copy of Evidence Explained by Elizabeth Shown Mills
  64. Helped someone find an ancestor using records you had never used for  your own research
  65. Visited the main National Archives building in Washington, DC
  66. Visited the National Library of Australia
  67. Have an ancestor who came to Australia as a ten pound pom
  68. Have an ancestor who fought at Gallipoli
  69. Taken a photograph of an ancestor’s tombstone
  70. Can read a church record in Latin (with a dictionary beside me!)
  71. Have an ancestor who changed his/her name
  72. Joined a Rootsweb mailing list
  73. Created a family website
  74. Have a genealogy blog
  75. Was overwhelmed by the amount of family information received from someone
  76. Have broken through at least one brick wall
  77. Done genealogy research at the War Memorial in Canberra
  78. Borrowed microfilm from the Family History Library through a local Family  History Centre
  79. Found an ancestor in the Ryerson index (and relatives)
  80. Have visited the National Archives of Australia
  81. Have an ancestor who served in the Boer War
  82. Use maps in my genealogy research
  83. Have a convict ancestor who was transported from the UK
  84. Found a bigamist amongst the ancestors
  85. Visited the National Archives in Kew
  86. Visited St. Catherine’s House in London to find family records
  87. Taken an online genealogy course
  88. Consistently cite my sources (usually)
  89. Visited a foreign country (i.e. one I don’t live in) in search of ancestors
  90. Can locate any document in my research files within a few minutes (mostly)
  91. Have an ancestor who was married four times (or more)
  92. Made a rubbing of an ancestors gravestone
  93. Followed genealogists on Twitter
  94. Published a family history book (on one of my families)
  95. Learned of the death of a fairly close relative through research
  96. Offended a family member with my research (surprised a few)
  97. Reunited someone with precious family photos or artifacts
  98. Have a paid subscription to a genealogy database
  99. Edited records on Trove


Review Unlock the Past History & Genealogy Expo, Geelong 2-3 Sep 2011

September 4th, 2011

Well it was a busy two days at the last for 2011 Unlock the Past (UTP) history and genealogy expo in Geelong on 2-3 September. Over 600 people attended and there were over 70 exhibitors and two streams of talks, some for a $5 fee and others free – so something for everyone. Those who pre-booked also had free entry while those who turned up on the day paid $5 entry. You could have a very cheap genealogy experience especially if you managed to avoid the many temptations at the various exhibitors tables. I didn’t avoid temptation – I succumbed repeatedly!

Starting with the talks as usual I found that the two streams presented me with some challenges as I couldn’t go to both at the same time!! It is a little easier for me as I have heard some of the other UTP speakers at other expos. The full program outlines the two streams so I will only comment on those I attended and those I regretted missing.

I haven’t attended any of Rosemary Kopittke’s talks for a while so sitting in on her talk about FindMyPast UK An Introduction was a bit of an eye opener as there is quite a lot of new records online. I find that I usually only think UK census but there is a lot more that may be of relevance to some of my families and I found myself doing a ‘must check this list’. The other choice was Susie Zada on the Genealogical Society of Victoria of which I am already a member.

At the next session I gave my talk on Asylums: Looking for the Sick, the Poor and the Aged so I had to miss David Rowe talking about Soldier Settlement in Victoria. This was a shame as I have an interest in that area. I hope someone else blogs about that talk.

Peter Mansfield talked about Regional Newspapers: A Wonderful Resource and I couldn’t agree more – he had some wonderful examples which highlights the richness of newspapers for family history research. Especially as more and more are digitised and available for easy searching through TROVE. The other choice was Lauren Bourke talking about Public Record Office Victoria my old workplace.

The session before lunch was Kate Prinsley talking about the Collections of the Royal Historical Society of Victoria (I’m a member and a fan of their website) and Rosemary talking about Scotland’s People which I heard in Mount Gambier. I skipped out early to enjoy my pie and latte out in the glorious sunshine – it was great weather both days.

After lunch I went to hear Mark Beasley from the Geelong Heritage Centre talk about its various resources for family history research (some online). Some Geelong girls married into my Gympie (Queensland) families and I have been promising myself a research trip there for some time. The Centre has BMD newspaper indexes from 1840-2011 for the Geelong Advertiser so I might get lucky.

I was also surprised to learn from both Peter and Mark that the Advertiser is the oldest continuing newspaper in Victoria but it is not on any digitisation list – almost seems a crime. No doubt there is a reason but given that Geelong was a major port for the goldfields I would have thought it rated a higher priority than some of the others that have been done or are on the list. Happy to be enlightened if someone knows. Opposite Mark was Andrew Kilsby talking about Captain Octavius Skinner Burton (this was a military talk and I had heard Andrew before).

During the next session I took the option of going round the exhibitors as I had heard Paul Parton talking about FamilySearch and Heather Garnsey talking about the Society of Australian Genealogists.

Dianne Snowden gave an excellent talk on Tasmanian Family History Research and I have pages of URLs to follow up, some I was already aware of but others were not that familiar so this might end up a blog in its own right. The other choice was Lauren Bourke talking on regional archives in Victoria – Ballarat and Bendigo.

I then had my It’s Not All Online talk so I had to miss good friend Liz Rushen’s talk on Researching Irish Immigrant Women so I consoled myself by buying a few books from Liz and my other good friend Perry McIntyre. Perry is one of the speakers on the next UTP cruise in November which has a Scots/Irish theme.

The last session on Friday was Kerry Farmer talking about DNA For Genealogists and Bruce Smith talking about Family History & Sports Archives – I had heard both before but listened in on Bruce’s again as there really is a lot of sporting history out there in newspapers, archives and historical societies.

Saturday’s program was equally good and first up was Rosemary Kopittke talking about Find My Past Australasia and again I found it interesting to see how much has been added to this since I last heard the talk. You really need to subscribe to e-newsletters to keep on top of changes – I do but sadly I can’t seem to keep on top of all my reading! The other session was on the Australian Institute of Genealogical Studies of which I am a member.

Next was Jenny Higgins from the National Library of Australia talking about TROVE and she had a useful handout explaining how to make the most of searching. She also talked about the Library’s E-Resources which are great for searching overseas newspapers. The other choice was Alan Phillips and Jacqui Haralstad from Clean Cruising talking about the UTP event War Comes to Australia to be held in Darwin in February next year.

Next was a change to the program with Helen Smith doing a Brickwalls talk which I had heard previously so I went to Kay Soderlund’s Preservation of Your Records talk. Kay from Preservation Australia gave a very detailed presentation on all the elements of preventive conservation and then gave strategies for lessening or removing the threat.

Before lunch the choice was Anne Burrows on Finding Families at the State Library of Victoria or Brad Argent taking about What’s New at Ancestry.com.au – I opted to listen to Brad and again was surprised to see how much is new and what is coming. I wasn’t aware that they now have wildcard searching and collection filtering – I really do need to read my e-newsletters!! Don’t forget they have free access of their immigration and travel records until 6 September so be quick.

After lunch I listed to Dianne Snowden talk about Heritage Tourism as I had heard Kerry Farmer give her Tracing English Ancestors talk in Mount Gambier. Susie Zada was next with her Look Local talk which I have heard before so I went to Laura Miles from Museums Australia (Victoria) talk on Museum Treasures of Regional Victoria. Laura talked about a new database (I had heard about it but hadn’t realised that it was now operational). It’s simply called Victorian Collections and it is an online cataloguing system that museums and historical societies can use to record their collections and that researchers can use to find items of interest. Only 2900 items so far but I am sure that will quickly grow. NB when I went to do the links for this blog, the database is not yet online but stay tuned.

Next was Carole Riley talking on Social Media for Family Historians which I have heard so I went to Andrew Kilsby’s talk on Researching Pre-Federation Military Ancestors. Whenever I hear Andrew’s talks I am envious of his photos – surely there must be a photo of my ancestors in their military uniforms somewhere. Perhaps when North Queensland newspapers get digitised I might find one!

I was next with my Google Tips & Tricks talk which is always well received so I missed Susie Zadas Sewerage Records: A Magnificent Untapped Resource which I am still to hear – but at least I have read the book.

Finally Paul Parton gave another talk on FamilySearch and Rosemary Kopittke talked about Connecting Families Online – both of which I had heard so I took the time to chat to someone researching the same family as me. Over the two days I saw lots of people chatting and swapping information so I expect lots of genealogy will be done in the coming weeks.

I hope people are still reading this very long blog – I won’t go into all the 70+ exhibitors but it was great for me to chat with friends I get to see at most of the expos. Ben and Cassie Mercer from Inside History have produced a very nice military issue for Issue 6 of their magazine and I am looking forward to having a read later this afternoon. I finally got to buy a copy of Chris Paton’s book Tracing Your Family History on the Internet – I have been trying to get a copy for months and the good folk at the Genealogical Society of Victoria brought a copy to Geelong just for me so that was great.

Seeing Carol Heath from Pixel by Pixel reminded me that I still haven’t got my parents wedding photo to her for a quote (met her a while back and discussed the photo with her then) – the photo is starting to fall apart as it is on a metal backing and little flakes are falling off. Mum has asked me to get it restored but I suspect the best option might be just a digital copy and then restore that. But that’s what experts are for so I must add visit Carol to my ‘to do’ list!

On Saturday evening after a catered buffet dinner on site, there was a performance Hit the Road Digger: The Building of the Great Ocean Road by Colin Mockett and Shirley Power from Drop of a Hat Productions which was an interesting mix of reading, singing and all illustrated by old photographs. It made for a late night after a big day. Unfortunately we had a rowdy crowd of young males also staying at the same motel which also impacted on our sleep and everyone else staying there.

Do have a look at the exhibitors list as it really is too long to go into here and there may be something that will be of interest to you, especially if you had ancestors in the Geelong and Bellarine areas.

Finally I will talk about the venue which I had originally thought might be too big but with all of the exhibitors it was probably just the right size. The main theatre room was upstairs (two flights of stairs or one lift) and I did find the stairs a bit much by the end of the two days. Although this might reflect the fact that I need to exercise more. Waiting for the lift was not an option with so many people wanting to go to the main stream of talks.

The upstairs room was a bit warm most times while the other theatre room which was on ground level was much cooler, even a bit too cool sometimes. The showbag had lots of info and I picked up more brochures as I went around all the displays.

A big plus was that you could get food onsite (sandwiches, pies, other fast food, cakes, muffins etc) and there were tables and chairs so lots of networking over lunch. There was even real coffee and other hot and cold drinks. Parking was plentiful and it was easy to reach by train as well so all up I think the Geelong Arena was a good venue for the expo.

Thanks must go to Alan Phillips and his UTP team for all the organisation that goes with an Expo and also to Susie Zada for all the local input which I think helped to make this the biggest and best of the 2011 history and genealogy expos.

I know this has been a lengthy blog but I hope those who couldn’t attend get something from my various links. Any research successes I have will be part of future blogs so stay tuned!


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